This discussion forum was created to allow you to ask questions and post comments on any of the information that you received from any of the videos within this series.

We also decided to post all of the videos here as well so you can have one centralized place to review past videos or catch up on video, just in case you may have missed one or two.

Post your questions and comments below!

What Is This All About?

Law Firm Marketing Research Results

Do You PLAN To Make More Money?

Does Your Staff Give a Shit About

Your Business?

What’s Retargeting?

Because We Messed Up, You Get a Free Private Coaching Session

Get Better Performance Out of Your Staff

What’s An After Action Analysis?

Remarketing For Small Law Firms Webinar

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How to Get Started With a Law Firm Marketing Plan

How to Build a Marketing Plan That Produces Successful Results

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Marketing Tip For Firms Grossing Between $250K to $750K

Law Firm Marketing Tips

This webinar which is usually reserved for Members Only, includes practical tips to market your firm.

Watch a Behind the Curtain peak at our process to becoming a member

How To Avoid Marketing Mistakes That Are Very Costly To Your Firm

This clip is from an older marketing campaign, but the information is still extremely relevant

22 replies
  1. Patricia Elizee
    Patricia Elizee says:

    What was the book that you suggested to read for key word strategy?? is it : The Long Tail: Why the Future of Business is Selling Less of More ??

    How are you doing the keyword planning?

    what website are you using to see how many people are searching which keywords?

    Keyword focused campaigns are more fore google ad words and not the ppc fb ads correct??

      RJON ROBINS says:

      The Long Tail: Why the Future of Business is Selling Less of More

      How are you doing the keyword planning? I’m not exactly sure what you mean by this question. Please elaborate.

      what website are you using to see how many people are searching which keywords? Google Adword planner. It’s a free tool offered by Google. Just do a google search for Keyword planner.

      Keyword focused campaigns are more fore google ad words and not the ppc fb ads correct?? Not correct. People are people. They think what they think on Google & FB & at the grocery store and everywhere else too. Once you figure out what your target market is thinking and what words they are using in one place you’ll find it’s usually the same everywhere else too.

  2. Todd M. Villarrubia
    Todd M. Villarrubia says:

    I like the 4th video (I’m a number geek!). I would be interested in how you go about establishing a base salary & a bonus structure for your team. While we all know we cant share fees with non-attorneys, I would live to tie in performance bonuses to specific activities that are making the firm more profitable, that the employee has control over, & so that everyone wins.

    • RJon Robins
      RJon Robins says:

      In Bryan’s case we have a specific income goal he has come to us with that is tied to certain personal goals he has in his life that I’m not at liberty here to share but let’s just say I’m pretty sure he’s prepared to walk through walls to make this happen for his life…and that they’re also “realistic” for him. Meaning, he believes these numbers are really possible for himself and he can envision that lifestyle. It’s an entry-level BMW & an apartment of my own lifestyle for a 20-something, not a lifestyles of the rich & famous lifestyle that is beyond his ability to really believe in at this point in his life.

      And keep in mind, this is different for each individual so you have to ask & inquire. Stay tuned for a video we happened to shoot about exactly this point also coincidentally with Bryant, last week. That should get posted in the next few days.

      Ok so we have his specific income goal. And I have my specific outcome/objective goal. And if I hit 100% of my goal (which he has alot of ability to positively or negatively influence) then he hits 100% of his income goal. Let’s just say it’s $50,000 for him and 75 new members per quarter for me AND at least 85% “show-up” rate to the Discovery Day. Because believe it or not, we have a number of potential new members every quarter whose lives could be so much better, they pay the 100% refundable Discovery Day fee…and then they go missing. We call them our “Lost Sheep”.

      Bryant’s main job is to get and keep in touch with everyone who is signed up to attend the upcoming Discovery Day, to be sure they get all their questions answered, have all the logistical info they need and that they feel welcome and know they’re going to be entering a “Safe Place”. His job is also to track down our Lost Sheep and find out “are you coming or not?”

      So we have a 3 part comp structure:

      Sign-Up Bonus: $100

      Show-Up Bonus: $40 (and remember, it’s all or nothing based on at least 85% overall show-up rate)

      Conversion Bonus: $20 (because we want this position to be in 100% alignment with the rest of the team so we all win when a new member engages our services & we all lose when they don’t. And at least for a portion of the time Bryant has the most influence over how a prospective new member is FEELING about the whole experience).

      OK but what about wage & hour issues? We pay minimum wage and then adjust the bonus to back that out of the total so that it works out to be minimum wage or more.

      OK but what about a law firm where you can’t pay an overt commission? That’s right you can’t. But you can pay a bonus for each quality control call your staff makes to ensure that new clients had a good experience, to make sure they got all their questions answered, to make sure they feel good about their interactions with your firm. And unless your staff is made up of morons they should be able to see that the more effective your firm’s marketing & sales systems are the more of these bonus opportunities they’re going to get. And don’t most State Bar Rules encourage us to be sure our clients feel cared for and to deliver great client communications & client service? What could be more consistent with the spirit and the letter of those rules than to financially incentivize your team to be sure your new clients have a great experience!?! (Please note I am NOT giving advice on bar rule compliance, check your local bar rules & use your own common sense 😉

  3. Larry
    Larry says:

    In vid 6, you mention “after actions analysis” and you’ve got a bunch of stuff (looks like instructions) written on the glass behind you.

    In my office, we usually discuss things after something went horribly wrong, and it’s more of a “don’t do __ again.” Is this what you mean by “after actions analysis?”

    • RJon Robins
      RJon Robins says:

      The most important thing about making an “After Action Analysis” work, is that it be a safe place for everyone involved. Including and ESPECIALLY those who made the most/biggest mistakes. It’s an opportunity to take an honest look at what went wrong and what went right. It’s easy to forget about being sure to point out and document what went right. Not because you need to be a cheerleader but because there’s alot that goes right “by accident” and you’ve got to capture that institutional knowledge, too. It begins as a brain-dump, but you as the leader need to be sure to keep everything “focused” on how will this comment, observation etc. be useful on a going-forward-basis? How will we be sure this doesn’t go wrong again or go right again, but only by accident. If you’ve never participated in one of our Business Planning Workshops, that could be a good place for you to get some training in how to do this because that’s the “tone” and the approach we take in those workshops. Last but not least, keep in mind and plan to say this at the beginning, middle and end of your after action analysis session that everything that went wrong is ultimately 100% YOUR RESPONSIBILITY as the owner of the business. Remember 100% control over your life requires 100% responsibility for everything that happens in your life and business.

  4. Dwayne W.
    Dwayne W. says:

    In that last video you talk about having your staff make a profit for you of at least three to five times more than your investment. That sounds a bit idealistic. How do you get an employee to produce three to five times more than you’re paying them? Take my receptionists as an example. If I’m paying her $27,000 per year, what could she possibly do to create $81,000 to $135,000 per year as a receptionist?

    I’ve been pretty successful with managing my firm over the years and we’ve been grossing on average $210,000 for the last 3 years. I have a staff of 3, and if what you say is true, then I should be able to gross a minimum of an extra $180,000 per year off my receptionist and my paralegal.

    • RJon Robins
      RJon Robins says:

      Dwayne, thanks for your comment/question.

      There was a time when I was flat broke, financially. And I attended a workshop being hosted by a person who was later to become a good friend and mentor. But at the time I didn’t know him very well, only by reputation really. And someone in the audience called bullshit on him about something he had said that was completely out of their realm of experience. It had to do with how long it could take to earn an extra $50,000 or something like that.

      My future mentor & friend happened to have a client in the audience and he asked her to comment on how realistic it was to leave-behind a level of awareness of how to do business where it takes months or even years to make an “extra” $50,000 and find yourself in a reality where making an extra $10,000, $50,000 or even an extra $100,000 could be accomplished in a matter of weeks or even in a matter of days in some cases.

      They had a little banter about it and I said to myself “Fuck you, you asshole. You have no idea about my situation. You have no idea about all of my challenges. If it was so easy then why isn’t everyone doing it!?!?”

      Fortunately, I stuck-around for the next couple of days and I warmed up to the guy and I ended up hiring him to help me. And today I live in a reality where I can and regularly do generate an extra $10,000, $50,000 and even several hundred thousand dollars “extra” on a pretty consistent basis. The key to this is that my ego allowed me to keep an open mind about the possibility that there could be some things about how to do business in a totally ethical, honest, professional and a very compassionate way that I simply hadn’t ever been exposed to before. Or if I had, I did not yet understand what I didn’t understand about what I didn’t understand.

      So here’s the point Dwayne, what you are referring to as “idealistic” is the actual a reality for hundreds of our Members. I can’t explain to you all about how to recruit, train, manage and make a profit with your staff. And yes, your $30K receptionist should contribute directly or indirectly $90-150K to your firm’s gross revenues.

      But just because I can’t explain it all in this format doesn’t mean it’s not true and it doesn’t mean we can’t and don’t help our members achieve this sort of efficiency in their business on a pretty regular basis. Let me ask you a few questions to help you begin to think about this in hopefully a new & different way:

      1.) Have you ever studied anything about how to hire, train & make a profit with a staff?

      2.) Do you have a written job description for your receptionist & paralegal that explains in plain English what their job is & what their job isn’t with clear measurements that you and they can use to tell if they’re doing the job you’ve engineered for them to do?

      3.) How much training did you give to your receptionist/paralegal before you set him or her loose in your business? How often do you revisit that training?

      4.) Which sounds like a better idea, taking responsibility for items 1-3 above and having your staff pay for themselves and then some…or dismissing what I am saying and staying stuck around $210,000 for another 3 years?

      Please visit http://www.HowToMANAGEaSmallLawFirm.com/Appointment to get on the schedule to have a talk with someone from my team and see if we can make a space for you at our next upcoming Discovery Day.

      That way you can raise your hand and get all of your questions answered by members of my team, hear questions & answers from other lawyers from around the country who are there to conduct their due diligence just like you, meet dozens of members from my team to evaluate their caliber for yourself and also meet more than a hundred of our current members from around the country who will be onsite at the same time for a different event and they’ll be happy to answer even more of your questions.

      Ask THEM how much profit THEY make from their receptionists & paralegals, etc.

  5. Albert
    Albert says:

    I’ve never thought to factor in ALL of the cost/expenses that I have when it comes to one of my team members. THANK YOU for making this point. I’m using your method with all my team members from now on. I will re-evaluate what my expectations are of each of them. On another not, what’s this non-owner insurance? If a member of my team is driving their personal vehilce, with their own insurance, and they get into an accident, then it’s on them. I’ll gladly defend my firm from anyone trying to come after us.

    • RJon Robins
      RJon Robins says:

      Albert, you’re welcome. And now I have to challenge you on something you’ve said. You say you’d “gladly” defend your firm? Wouldn’t your time be better-invested building your business instead of wasting your time defending your firm for something that could (and should) have been included in your business liability package?

      I’m not trying to give you shit here, it’s just that we see so many lawyers whose law firms aren’t growing as much as they could and often times it’s because they don’t have anyone in their corner to call them on it when they say things that don’t make alot of sense.

      “I’ll gladly defend my firm from anyone trying to come after us.” Really?

      So let’s say your secretary is driving her own personal automobile that’s not owned by the firm. And she’s out running an errand for the firm. Could be on the way to pick something up from Office Depot, dropping something off at the courthouse…and she’s texting & driving and whammo she causes an accident. It’s clearly her fault. There are witnesses. The person she crashed into is being very reasonable in their demands. Some of the witnesses are nuns. They were all holding their smart phones shooting a bunch of selfies and caught the whole things on video. Your secretary made an excited utterance along the lines of “I knew I shouldn’t have been texting & driving while running this errand for my employer”.

      How glad are you going to be that you chose to work with an insurance advisor who took the time to tell you that for just a few hundred dollars you can probably add a “non owned auto” rider to your business liability policy…and then instead of being glad that you now get to defend a total loser case that you have no insurance to protect you from you can instead invest those hours to deploy a marketing campaign that can generate you and extra $100,000 next year?

      Albert, I would HIGHLY recommend you get your hands on a very helpful little book by my friend Michael Carroll that can give you a good education to make more profitable decisions about your law firm’s insurance needs: https://insuringlawyer.com/book/

      I am also getting the feeling that there may be other areas of your business where you may not have had the benefit of having anyone to really help you think it all through. For example, do you have a written marketing plan? A written plan for how someone other than you (or you on a bad day) can reliably convert prospective new clients into paying clients? How about written out policies, procedures and systems for how the work is supposed to get done by your staff (or when you have staff) so that you don’t become a slave to your firm? Written budget to help you plan for and navigate the next 12 months to profits?

      Albert, I have been working with thousands & thousands of lawyers for more than the last 15 years and I have something of a sixth-sense about these things. I have the sense that you could be having alot more fun and enjoying alot more profits and free time from your law firm (while it keeps running without you having to be there all the time). Who do you have in your corner to help you be sure the job of the Managing Partner, COO &/or CFO is being attended to on a quarterly, monthly and weekly-basis?

      At the risk of stating the obvious I think it may be time you speak with someone from my team about getting us in your corner to help you: http://www.HowToMANAGEaSmallLawFirm.com/Appointment

  6. Jeff
    Jeff says:

    During the remarketing webinar Edwin said that attorneys should use this feature. I’ve read that attorneys cannot use remarketing because it violates google’s policies.

    • Edwin J.
      Edwin J. says:

      Hi Jeff,

      Google’s remarketing policy does not specifically state that attorneys can’t use remarketing. However, it does have restrictions on certain categories that are prohibited from remarketing, and some of those categories will affect some attorneys such as criminal defense, bankruptcy, and divorce attorneys but there are a ton of legal fields that are NOT restricted by Google’s remarketing policies such as estate planning, intellectual Property, corporate, Tax, Contracts, Civil Litagtion, Merger & Acquisitions, Entertainment, Real Estate, etc.. If you practice in any of these fields, then it’s fair game.

      For those that do fall into the prohibited categories above, there are ways to comply with the policy and still use remarketing, but it will require some creativity and some changes to your main website’s content.

      You can find Google’s Policies on remarketing lists here: https://support.google.com/adwordspolicy/answer/143465?hl=en This page will explain the personalized advertising restrictions (which affects the remarketing lists that you create in your adwords account).

  7. Jessica Harrelson
    Jessica Harrelson says:

    I watched the remarketing webinar and saw the Google’s analytics that was mentioned tracked some pretty detailed information about the website. I would like to know more about Google’s analytics. I know it’s free but how much information does it really track? Is it better to go with a paid version that tracks more information than Google? My current site was built about 4 years ago and the company that created the website for me also created a special dashboard with it’s own analytics, where I can view all kinds of data on what’s happening on my site in real time. At the time my site was built, I remember having a brief conversation on Google’s analytics and they told me that their version was way better than Google’s, it tracked more information that Google’s, and it was real time(up to the minute). I opted for their version since I believed it to be better and I have been paying them a monthly fee of $199 for the analytics dashboard that shows me all the data. When I saw the demo of Google’s Analytics, it seems like it shows the same information and some that I don’t have access to. I’d like to know which is better? I was told Google does not have up to the minute tracking.

    • Edwin J.
      Edwin J. says:

      Hi Jessica,

      Google Analytics is very robust and tracks a TON of info. I usually recommend going with Google Analytics as a rule of thumb because it

      1) is free
      2) tracks ALL of the important data that most website owners need to know about their site.
      3) allows you to create customized reports
      4) shows you where you can make improvements on your site
      5) pretty Easy To Use

      Jessica, I don’t know where you got your information from, but Google Analytics (GA) does show real time stats. Years ago (at least 4 +) GA didn’t provide real-time metrics but a lot has changed since then, so if the only reason you’re using the custom analytics dashboard is because of real-time stats, then you may want to consider switching over to GA. I don’t know what other capabilities your current dashboard provides you, but be aware that a lot of times companies will pull information via a feed from GA and then just display the stats differently and call it their own analytics and charge a monthly fee for it. Not sure if that’s what you’re current company is doing, but it’s worth looking into. It could save you $2400 in yearly expenses. For 99.999999% of law firm owners, GA is more than enough to track all the pertinent stats needed to make real decisions for your online marketing plans. I wouldn’t suggest paying for analytics when one of the best is available for free.

      As for the capabilities of GA, like I said earlier, it’s very robust. There’s a ton of valuable information that it tracks such as:

      – The keywords that people are using to get to your site
      – The pages that people are landing on and how long they’re staying on each page – This lets you know if people are interested in
      what you’re saying on each page
      – What devices people are using to get to your site (mobile, desktop, tablet) This is important because it lets you know how much
      time and money to invest in mobile friendly marketing

      and the list goes on and on. Email me and I can go over this in detail. If we have a large number of people interested in learning more about GA, then we can put on a quick webinar to cover the topic. For those that are interested, just send me an email.

  8. Sean Mckenzie
    Sean Mckenzie says:

    The video “How to Get Started With a Law Firm Marketing Plan” has some good points, but can you give more details on planning something like this out?

    • Edwin Jean-Francois
      Edwin Jean-Francois says:

      Not a problem Sean,

      I’ve got the perfect video for you that will explain in detail, how to build a law firm marketing plan.
      Stay Tuned, and we’ll post it within the next 48 hours.

    • Edwin Jean-Francois
      Edwin Jean-Francois says:


      Take a look at the latest video titled “How to Build a Marketing Plan That Produces Successful Results”. This video will teach you how to create a law firm marketing plan.

      Be sure to track the results of all your marketing efforts, good or bad, so that you can start organizing them into categories of HOT(good results) and FLOPS(bad or no results).

      One of the benefits of keeping track of your law marketing campaigns is that once you’ve collected results on multiple campaigns, you can then start recycling the most successful campaigns. And what I mean by “recycling” is that you can reuse a campaign that yielded good results from the past. EXAMPLE: Lets say it’s the first quarter and you decided to run an email marketing campaign that resulted in 8 new clients over the quarter. Then in the second quarter, you created a successful campaign around offering a “free resource” for your prospective clients, (for arguments sake, let’s say you’re an estate planning/real estate attorney and you created a Estate Planning Guide /Ebook as a free resource to educate and help your prospective clients) and this free ebook campaign resulted in 11 new clients within the second quarter. Because you know these two campaigns were very effective, you can recycle (reuse) the emailing campaign from Q1 in Q3 and then recycle the “free resource” campaign from Q2 in Q4. Or you can use the campaign from Q1 of this year in Q1 of next year, etc…

      A real life example of this is the video that you watched that prompted you to leave your comment. The video “How to Get Started With a Law Firm Marketing Plan” was recycled from a different marketing campaign that was done a while back. We decided to use the video on this page because the information still holds true, it’s relevant, it’s very informative and it has helped a lot of attorneys like you.

      Just be sure that when you recycle a law firm marketing campaign, you update the content and message within the campaign and ensure that it’s relevant for the current time frame that you will reuse it in.

      If you’re questioning your current marketing activities, feel free to schedule an appointment to evaluate what’s going on with your current marketing strategy.


  9. Russ
    Russ says:

    I’m curious if you have any tips on how to stand out from the crowd. I work with a lawyer that has a ton of experience (30+ years). People love him – once they meet him. He has a high success rate, once he has retained a client. But he doesn’t stand out from the crowd. He’s “just another lawyer” that does personal injury, divorce law, etc. He’s older – around 75. His firm income varies. He might have a $500k year (gross). But he’s had a few years where the firm has made over $1M. It’s sporadic. The other problem he has is that because he’s old and wants to pass the firm to his son (who works as a lawyer in the firm), he needs to find a way to make the firm not so much about him but about the business – like you talk about in your video. His son is not nearly as engaging and personable as he is. Which could be a problem, long term.

  10. Edwin Xiao
    Edwin Xiao says:

    Hi, thanks for all your videos and for generously sharing your experience. They are extremely insightful. I have no means of setting an appointment with you (I live in Taiwan) so I am leaving this message here to hoping you notice this and would respond.

    Could you provide advice and insight a few more topics? I would like to know when and how should a practice merge with another one, and the things I should look out for, and what should one considers when taking on a new partner (could be promoting a senior associate to an equity partner or taking in someone from ‘outside’).

    If you do see this message, I thank you in advance for taking the trouble to read this.

  11. Leslie Gustafsson
    Leslie Gustafsson says:

    What advice can you give to a firm that has achieved some really good success but it seems we’ve reached maximum capacity. We grew to $247,000 per year and have been averaging around $225k for the past 3 years.


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